Key Fixes -Atari Read- [Archive] - Forums Atari Europe

KingsRevenge

15-01-2005, 03:25

Graphics -
The water effect is kind of weak, I don't know how much water is used in the game, but S.W.I.N.E. had the best looking water in any RTS game I've played. You may want to check out their water effect it was very good and the technique didnt seem to processor taxing from what I saw.

I had issues with the alphablending in the particle system.

LINK (http://www.instinctz.net/kingsrevenge/images/alphablend.JPG)

I use a 9800 NP about to OC it to 9800 XT levels. I use the OmegaDrivers. Besides that particle system problem I had there the rest of the games graphical expects had no glitches I noticed.

I would like to have a different POV of the battle field perhaps a slightly further out zoom would be nice.

Controls-
Refine the unit clicking system to be more like current RTS's so people can just hop in and play without being confused.

Add a deselecting feature as was mentioned before.

Add the option for right click or left click dominance.

TanKilleR

15-01-2005, 04:28

Let me say, I love the game, so please I agree with KingsRevenge. We need to make a fixs post. Let no one that read this think that we hate this game:biggringr

The water needs better gfx.

EVA needs to stfu. She talks everytime some dude is under attack or dies. Just add something in the word update area on the hud.

Let us zoom out more.

Fix the hud map with better gfx, so I can find my way around.

Let us deslect units.

Add the CnC style slecting. None of this reverce slecting.

Make the hud more small.

Let us rotate the screen.

Let us edit more settings so we can have better game play, for thouse that dont have alot of ram, or good video cards.

Remove alot of the green stuff when you slect an airstrike. Very annoing, and lags game play.

Make the onscreen waypoints more small.

Add a quick scroll with mouse able.

I3ag_OF_I3ones

15-01-2005, 06:15

i dont think they acre lo :biggringr

TanKilleR

15-01-2005, 06:27

I think they do. Why else would they have fourms even before the games releace data? I am sure their not going to pull a EA CnC on this one, hehe:D

AgmLauncher

15-01-2005, 07:22

Agreed on all that:
Critical changes:
-Option to switch to a "left click" interface
-Ability to right click in the middle of the screen and rapidly scroll over the map in the direction you move the mouse. Please dont reverse it like in DoW, that was just stupid.
-Ability to deselect units (inherently necessary with the right click rapid scroll)

Extraneous changes:
-Slightly smaller HUD height. It's a bit too intrusive
-Increase max camera height by 25%
-Make the tool tip pop up box on the right MUCH smaller. No need for such a big box to pop up for just one or two lines of text.

The critical changes listed are simply that: critical. Your primary audience is the C&C audience. A LOT of C&C fans are interested in this game because it's so similar. The reversed interface and horrible scrolling will turn them away. These are all really minor changes to be honest. I dont see what would be so hard about changing them.

KingsRevenge

15-01-2005, 07:32

Originally posted by I3ag_OF_I3ones
i dont think they acre lo :biggringr

*HINT**HINT* They do :), stuff like this helps them become aware of issues within the player base and this msg board is a core of their base.

KingsRevenge

15-01-2005, 07:43

BUG - When the mission ended I was in the process of capturing a hostage with the hostage taking cursor visible, the game then played the ending cinema and after that the cursor was the hostage taking cursor instead of the regular green cursor.

Leaky Faucet - Sometimes you can't get to your wounded soldier will there be some way that 2 soldiers can drag him to safety or something or give wounded soldiers very very limited mobility? That helicopter is kind of clumsy.

Interface - Could you place that sell building button someplace else so that it won't be accidently clicked? Also any chance of being able to reorder the unit build hotkeys? Alot of them are spread all over the keyboard, if possible we the end users can edit them to our likings, or you guys could come up with a better close in design.

Tiberian

15-01-2005, 09:28

Maybe i have a bug don't know for sure.
But i hit by accident the windows key @ my keyboard during the game, and ended up with a BOSD .
Afther reboot i tried taskswitching and it seems that taskswitching and starting up an app give's me a bsod. Other games i play don't do this ( HL2/CS/CCG ZH/)

But man i love this game allready it give's me the seem feeling like C & C did years ago..... Can't discribe it but this game is going to be a winner if they are listing to te community..

imported_Rhodan

15-01-2005, 12:42

Originally posted by TanKilleR

Let us zoom out more.

Fix the hud map with better gfx, so I can find my way around.

Let us deslect units.

Add the CnC style slecting. None of this reverce slecting.

Make the hud more small.

Remove alot of the green stuff when you slect an airstrike. Very annoing, and lags game play.

Make the onscreen waypoints more small.

The above are valid points, as I said before, my mine gripe is the zoom level, PLEASE let us ZOOM OUT more !

The second most annoying thing is the unit selection.

Auxarius

15-01-2005, 13:04

Let us deselect and
Zoom out more

These are 2 _critical_ changes that has to be made. I think that remnant is more personal for every player.
But i also agree that HUD is horribly big, there should be some option to make it smaller, let's say Big Hud (like now) Medium Hud (only things that we need to use and see fast.) Compact (critial only, like map and airstrikes) In Med and Compact remnant would appear after selecting unit, buidling. (but in smaller boxes ofcourse.)

TanKiller - press middle mouse button to rotate, or Ctrl+arrows. (or if you ment rotating buidlings than yes, it should be added)

vicious6

15-01-2005, 13:58

-I think the deselect option is universally agreed. I'm pressing unused group buttons to deselect my units.
-The other issue that seems to be the general census is the fact that the medevac chopper could be considered almost useless. I know there should be a balance between realism and playability, but having a bunch of soldiers sit around while one bleeds to death is silly. Either have the chopper pick up wounded and rapidly transport to hospital, or at least allow infantry to drag wounded. I would think there is enough time left till release to add one of those options?
-I don't dislike how aircraft are handled. Many say "I WANT GENERALS BLAH BLAH BLAH.." (no offense intended) but... this isn't a sequel to Generals. The only thing that seems a little iffy to me is in multiplayer. The air-to-air range on the aircraft is very long. Also, it seems normal anti-air units don't do much damage to fighters such as F-18 and JSF. I don't know about other people, but I personally don't want every mulitplayer game to be a race to see who can make the most planes!

Just as a side note, something I really liked that was almost nothing in terms of features; landing on a building's roof. I attempted to place my medevac on top of a building and was very pleased when it worked. Being a special-operations buff, I would love the fact that I could insert a blackhawk full of infantry to such a place. I don't know how it will be handled and my apologies if it was brought up in a past post, but will infantry inside transport choppers have the ability to rappel? Another one of those minor details that adds some nice eye candy and a good level of realism at no extra cost.

MetalPhoenix

15-01-2005, 15:31

-There should be a smooth zoom, like in Generals/ZH.
-The AA units seem fine to me. I lost at least 4 Hornets to a couple of Tunguskas.
-I dunno if this is already going to be implemented, but there should be combat medics, seeing as how often the infantry are going to be in need of medical attention.
-What's more, you should be able to pack infnatry into the Medevac so that they can be healed faster. It should be like the Ambulance in ZH: You can get healed just standing next to it, but if you get in, it's much faster.
-The Starcraft-style interface works for me, but there should be the option to reverse it.
-TFT commandos=1337:D

TanKilleR

15-01-2005, 19:43

Originally posted by Auxarius
TanKiller - press middle mouse button to rotate, or Ctrl+arrows. (or if you ment rotating buidlings than yes, it should be added)

Cool, thanks for the heads up, I did not know that:tup:

rojar_parit

15-01-2005, 20:49

dont really care if left or right click, but please make it so that ALL actions are done with either left clicking OR right clicking not 50% one way and 50% the other.

Another point I have to agree with is a "longer" zoom out is definately need to ge t a good overview of the battlefield.

The observation drones...would be cool if you could set the deploying soldier to auto-repeat that function. Cause after playing I never did figure out when the drones expired until my group of sentrys started dying that were behind the drone or at least a notification that the drone is gone.

I also found the AI of the soldiers a little weak. For instance they captured enemy POWs automatically some of the time, the rest of the time they just walked by them and ignored them..and yes I had CQB researched also there were a few "elite" soldiers in the group. (dunno if that makes a difference). Maybe a behavior switch for groups auto capture on/off ?? Another thing that really annoyed me was that the soldiers do not seem to automatically go over to guard mode when they are just standing there, I lost lots of snipers this way....I mean the range of a Barret and an RPG are very diffferent ( I am not even complaining that soldiers survived direct hits from RPGs or Barrets).

Otherwise I was a little disappointed that the demo was so short before tossing us into the mission a tutorial would have been nice. A little lesson on the different uses of the snipers and assault soldiers would be good.

TanKilleR

15-01-2005, 21:19

I never uderstood why in the demo, when one of your troops gets too shot up, and sits their wonded, you have to leave him their(before med eva chopper) they should give other solders the abilty to heal others, or carry them back to base for healing. Not just leaveing them their for dead.

2potscreama

16-01-2005, 00:42

I do hope you guys all realise that Atari is never going to read this thread.

Ive only ever seen one Atari employee on the forum and thats the Forum Administrator. Since he doesnt have anything to do with games, dont hold your breath on this stuff ever getting seen by anyone remotely important at Atari.

Ad-Aware

16-01-2005, 01:36

There seesm to be one now..im nto sure if his real or not..but he has the atari symbol and says "Atari Employee", ofcourse i could write that my self and stick an atari symbol.but i think the board admins might have disabled the use of the Word atari in your Avatar..so he might be the real deal.

PqLear

16-01-2005, 01:41

Originally posted by TanKilleR
I think they do. Why else would they have fourms even before the games releace data? I am sure their not going to pull a EA CnC on this one, hehe:D Of course we read every single posting, even if unortunately we don't have time to reply to all of them. All comments are appreciated, and all suggestions are very good. Some of them have already been fixed during polish/tuning, some remain to be done, and some unfortunately for various reasons will have to wait for a future iteration of the game.

About the camera, there are two thing you can try to get a better overview; either use the aircraft tracking function (in the middle of the HUD, just to the left of the unit information area) while launching an airstrike, and you'll get a good overview; or use the chase camera on a helicopter (in this demo only the MedEvac Blackhawk) by selecting it and pressing ' (the apostrophe key; on a US keyboard). You can also use the chase camera on a selected aircraft to be able to move the camera around.

It's not the same thing as zooming out more using the mouse wheel, but it will give you a good idea how un-user-friendly it is to locate, select and identify units on the ground in this camera view.

akula89

16-01-2005, 01:59

Awesome to see Atari is reading. this is the type of stuff that makes me tell my friends and others to try out the game, when I see the developers actually give a damn about the people who might buy their games :tup:

Will the full version have the ability to zoom out more as well as deselect with a mouse click? :confused:

TanKilleR

16-01-2005, 02:02

All right!...wate is that a good thing or not:weirdblue
Please dont over look the annoing mouse slecting. And way over sized hud.:lolblue:

painfulsunrise

16-01-2005, 02:22

It's good to see Atari get involved with the game's buyers. That is something not every company would do.

Anyway, I think some of the voices in the game need changed.. like some of the units. It's really genaric.

And the unit deselecting needs worked on.

AgmLauncher

16-01-2005, 04:50

I seriously hope right-click rapid scroll isnt going to be one of those features that wont be implemented in the game. That ONE simple thing alone will prevent me from buying the game tbh. I know that sounds shallow, but I play RTS games for the thrill of micromanagment. The current key scrolling method is 10,000% inadequate for micromanagement :(

I really hope that it makes the final cut, or at least a patch. Can anyone tell me if there will be a replay feature in the game? No replays = dead game after 6 months. Replays create MP communities and hold them together. No replays means no community and a short life cycle.

TanKilleR

16-01-2005, 05:05

Agreed
If they dont fix the slecting ****, I'm not going to wast my money trying not to die, while I figure out how to work it. I dont see why they just cant copy the way CnC has it. Eveyones used to that way.

AgmLauncher

16-01-2005, 06:16

Yeah, they just copied some sort of industry standard, which is the WRONG standard. I can deal with the right click stuff, (even though that's still the wrong way to do it), but to rely on key scrolling and sticky select is simply wrong. Whoever thought that up (cough blizzard) was smoking ***** tbh. It's NOT good for micro-intense RTS games.

KingsRevenge

16-01-2005, 06:47

While hanging out in the IRC chat room at.

wolf.uplinkcorp.net #actofwar

Some of thse topics came up.

Better notification and sounds effects when is suing commands like the ambush function, that was wierd you didn't really know if you had it working or not.

If possible a way to alleviate some problems with the game is have parts of it open to the community for 3rd party development such as Tribes, HL, and the game that started it all Total Annihilation. Get the community to fix the broken or leaky parts of the game so that you guys can work on other important things.

We talked about the helicopters and how we barely used them, even though the demo featured infantry, I figured I'd better note that.

Unit ranges inside of the bunkers were kind of wierd, I'll try to test it out a bit more so I can be sure of what to do specifically.

Ad-Aware

16-01-2005, 07:41

KingsRevenge and I also discussed Debri..or rather...Lack of it...didnt notice too much of it about.

And fighting isnide buildings was a bit confused with the Silhouettes of the Infantr BEHIND the buildings.
I was thinking...maybe make the top of the building transparet..so we can see the full figure of the infatry, rather then a confused Silhouettes of the ifnatry behind it.

Also the Ifnatyr mooving insdie the building was erratic..and quite frnakly...really strange.i couldnt tell if it was sometimes behinds the building or on the bottom level.

And we ofcourse discussed many good points...but these are some thigns of interest then in my opnion need some frther adressing.

rojar_parit

16-01-2005, 10:40

OK while playing the demo last night I did something I thought would be real clever: I put my heavy snipers into a bunker (six of em) so that they could defend my base along the beach approach. Now I was building up another unit to run north and take out the SAMs all of a sudden I see my bunker getting beat on by four RPGs. This in itself isnt a problem ;) , what I see as a problem is one RPG would target my rightmost soldier and fire at him. The snipers gun would disappear, (either reloading or taking cover both of which I can understand,) but the other guys I had in the bunker just sit there and twiddle their thumbs or is this just me?

Ok why isnt it possible to fire when one is in stealth mode to overwatch an area? Had tried with several snipers to cover beach with having them lying down but then they always popped up to fire, there was a flash "reveal" the sniper loaded his weapon and was dead because the enemy had fired by the time the reveal animation was gone.....I mean I found it cool to see the guys getting covered with sand as they were lying there, but shouldnt they at least be able to get one shot off before being spotted? After that I understand their cover being blown and having to reposition.

Ad-Aware

16-01-2005, 11:08

wat do you mean covered by sand?
ANd bte i had the smae problem with the RPGS firing and my bunker getting owned.

The thign with snipers, s they get revealed..but there "Aiming" or "Loadingg" their guns, they cant fire right away like a rifelman...thats their drawback..is they have set up time...so as much as i agree witih your point about them only being revealed after there set up..it would make it kinda overpowered if u coud have isnvible snipers get attleast one confirmed kill...wihtout having the opportunity to sotp them first.
Becasue in this game...there IS opportunity to keep yur guys alive...even when fighting in the streets..its all about forward socuting...so far we only have the Infatry drones and planes...and the deteniton camp..bu im guessing theres gona be emphasis on smart planning rather then mindless rushing in of units.

MadHavoc

16-01-2005, 16:42

nice, that atari actually care about this game.

ok a question then..
will you release any further demos, for example a mp demo with 1 map or somethin like that, or skirmish with one faction.
u dont have to put all units in it, but at least some tanks and vehicles. so the players could find out what role vehicles will play in this game.

another questions :
-will there be any heroes in skirmish or Multiplayer. if yes, will they have any special abilities ? (like swimming or explosives..)
-what is the tanker unit actually for ? ive seen it in the unit roster and in the demo, but didnt figured it out.

KingsRevenge

16-01-2005, 20:08

Interface Fixing -

I would like for the ability to know which buildings are garrisonable and which aren't. Sometimes I'll try to put my units in a building and it wont be garrisonable and sometimes you have ot place the cursor over a specific part of the building just to get your guys to go in. Also the evacuate interface is clunky becuase you have to click on the building in a certain spot to get it selected.

I also would like that eagle option to be removed or changed to something differnet clicking that to pause or bring up esc menu in a multiplayer game could mess you up.

Also could a better option for selecting which way your unit faces when hiding inside of cover be avaiable?

When enemy soldiers die and sink into the sand after their bodies disappear their shadows are still being rendered a few seconsd after they fall through.

Like someone else stated in another post, I think POW's need to give more money if they have a higher rank.

Also a varied pattern of incoming planes. That way it ownt be super simple to setup defenses along planes most obvious routes.

Is that good for you Tank :)

TanKilleR

17-01-2005, 03:33

You King, why not just edit your post mate. Your sig is lagging me out:tonguegre

MetalPhoenix

17-01-2005, 15:29

Oh, and there's a bug with the shadows:

http://img137.exs.cx/img137/8314/shadowbug4py.jpg

Ad-Aware

17-01-2005, 15:48

yea happens with ifnatry also..at first i thoght it was some sort of weird occurence with the sun..then i thought it may be a bug.

TanKilleR

17-01-2005, 22:59

beware of the evil ghost dune buggy shadow.....woooo:dark:

KingsRevenge

18-01-2005, 03:52

I think work may need to be done on touching up some of the graphical cue's to make their function more obvious. Such as the ambush feature. Also possibly removing some of the clutter when you use planes since people seem to complain about it. I guess make it so that the icons are simple and direct.

Also is it possible to make/force a plane to drop all its payload on a certain target instead of wasting it on a tank along the way?

Force fire may need to be implemented into the game.

Wezz6400

18-01-2005, 23:49

Force fire would be very nice (we discussed that on IRC). However I do like the feature that planes kill what they encounter on their way (they never use more then half their bombs though, so they always drop at least half their bombs on the target). In other RTS games some tanks can kill a complete attack wave of planes without the planes doing anything back. In AoW if it's the right type of plane they will kill the tanks, you still might lose some planes but not all of them. And you got rid of those tanks, so another wave will hit the target.

KingsRevenge

19-01-2005, 06:51

Found another issue.

The tactical overlay button is the button with the airplane and the nuke symbol in it. It is the button that allows you to hide the aircraft buttons in the demo. When you click it the overview button either hides or dispalys. While its displayed you can use the hotkeys F3 to do the drone attack. However if you hide it so taht it is not displayed the hotkeys such as F3 for the airplanes do not work, meaning you have to keep that chunk of the HUD up while playing.

Once I noticed this I figured that it was because you guys had the bookmarking of terrain, I tried ctrl+f1 to bookmark a section of terrain, I hit F1 and wasn't transported anywhere at all.

BOMBLORD

19-01-2005, 11:11

land bookmark ? :confused: thats something new for me.

KingsRevenge

22-01-2005, 21:11

I found one bug in the demo. Hopefully you guys fixed it in retail but if not here it is.

If you place snipers inside of the bunker above where the default build point is for the first barracks. Scroll to a different part of the map, the best thing is to move down and have a piece of the land visible and mostly water on the screen when you press evatucate the snipers will evacuate and automatically appear at the waters edge. I tested other methods and it seemd that the snipers would automatically jump to the spot closest to where the fog of war was.