Unresolved questions (spoilers galore, beware)

[sparrowtm]

Hey,

after finishing Fahrenheit for the first time (and loving it), there are a few things which I might not have noticed, or have not been answered. Any help, speculations or superior knowledge is appreciated :wink2:


1.) Agathas death. Who killed her? Clan purple or clan orange?
2.) Was Agathas spirit-form always possessed by the clan purple cyborg?
3.) If it was not, when did clan purple take her form over?
4.) How did clan purple resurrect Lucas, them being A.I.s, not magicians?
5.) How was the cyborg able to manifest itself in the real world?
6.) The tarot-cards showed Carla a very precise version of the future. Was Tommy a psychic? Or were the "magical viiiibes" going on in NY responsible? Coincidence?
7.) The Oracle said he waited over 2000 years for that day to come. Which is strange, since he shows prominent Meso-American features, yet to my knowledge Meso-America wasn't inhabited at that time. Or at least, Mayan culture and rituals didn't exist yet. Am I wrong? If not, where did the Oracle come from?
8.) What happened in the month between Lucas meeting Carla at the graveyard and the next scene? Did they just idle and waited for Lucas to get another vision?

These are the first questions that came to my mind. Remember, "it was a plot device" doesn't count as an answer. :laugh:

[sotos]

Hey,

8.) What happened in the month between Lucas meeting Carla at the graveyard and the next scene? Did they just idle and waited for Lucas to get another vision?

These are the first questions that came to my mind. Remember, "it was a plot device" doesn't count as an answer. :laugh:

It does not say
it is a scenario gap
(Probably they had not the time to finish the game so they left it empty and leave the player to make assumptions of what maybe happened just for an excuse)

Well i am sure the "kiss part" they just do it to make the hero look cooler from just an average person and have a typical Hollywood-movie end

They wanted a typical good romantic ending (if these is the only end game sequence)

Anyway
The Chicks always have a crash with the Hero no matter how much they hate him or how they see him from the start :rolleyes:

...and They lived happy ever after like in the fairy tales :rolleyes:

END OF STORY

[sparrowtm]

They wanted a typical good romantic ending (if these is the only end game sequence)

There are at least three :)

[deluxxe]

1.) Agathas death. Who killed her? Clan purple or clan orange?

good question. You see someone jump out the window right when you enter the room so you'd think it would have to be human. It can't be the Oracle because, according to the professor, the oracle needs to possess someone to kill a human. Also, if it was the Oracle, Lucas would have seen it happen. Must have been clan purple... but how? good question.

[Chris_]

the question I have is Lucas dead or not? Falling from who knows how high, Agatha/the AI says he's dead, no visible breath in the last 20 minutes of the game, yet he can still get Carla pregnant and walk around at the end? Which is it?

maybe I don't want to know...during that sex scene I was yelling at my monitor "dude, he's dead! You're doing it with a dead guy! Ahhhh, that's no good."

[montnoir]

1.) Agathas death. Who killed her? Clan purple or clan orange?
2.) Was Agathas spirit-form always possessed by the clan purple cyborg?
3.) If it was not, when did clan purple take her form over?
If you read Lucas PDA towards the end, he writes that Agatha/AI has been trying to manipulate him ever since the diner. So that would imply that Agatha had always been the AI. But that would raise the question who or what got killed in Agatha's apartment for the police to find...

Oh yeah... we never see anyone going out the window. It's just Lucas who says he saw someone... but Lucas also sees giant mites attacking him and flying evil angel statues...

6.) The tarot-cards showed Carla a very precise version of the future. Was Tommy a psychic? Or were the "magical viiiibes" going on in NY responsible? Coincidence?
Tommy says his grandmother was a psychic, so that would suggest he was one too although he didn't practice it, he used it more as a party-trick to have fun, he probably wasn't aware of "his powers" himself.

[Caame]

If you read Lucas PDA towards the end, he writes that Agatha/AI has been trying to manipulate him ever since the diner. So that would imply that Agatha had always been the AI. But that would raise the question who or what got killed in Agatha's apartment for the police to find...

After the roof fight when you choose to give over the child or not you can ask a few questions. When you ask the fake Agatha(cyborg) about Agatha it says the she died in the apartment.

[Euan-]

Post removed - I realised this made no sense :P Could a mod please remove my reply

[Fahrenheit_fan]

When Lucas starts having the visions he's all susprised by them and yet in the army flashback scenes he's had them since he was a kid so my questions are

A) How come he doesn't remember having them when he has the first vision in his apartment?

and
B) If he hasn't had a vision since he was a kid why did he stat having them again during and after the murder?

[Acleacius]

I think the AI has always been using not only Agatha but more importantly the CROWS :)
Thru out the game the crows have been present at many points in the game and if I remember correctly when he looks at them it cost -5 mood.

Since the AI had the ability to implant a chip to give Lucas imortaltiy, they could have some how used Agatha in the same way, because she did seem scared at the end of the first Lucas vist and did seem to know about the Oracale.

I am guessing the AI studied her ability to see visons and implanted the crows with chips to project your movements after the murder, since the crows had been following the Orcale to track his movements.
Lucas became a link as long as he was alive...errr apparently even after death :)

I would say it was the AI that killed Agatha before she could warn Lucas about there existance, remember all the AI had to do was touch Lucas to kill him.

Just because Lucas says someone jumped out the window doesnt me they killed Agatha any more than Lucas did.
Plus as far as I can tell the Oracale works alone unless doing scarifices and cant be touched by blood or some such.

When the Oracale talked to the counsel he mentioned something stoped his power which was derived from that source power (doh! cant remember name now), so the AI power is at least as powerful as the Oracales.
The said it used her form to make it easier to comuicate with Lucas, so if they can manifiest others forms then then should beable to manifest themselves, thou their power/technology was very vague and basicly Deus Ex anyway :)

I really didnt know they lost a month or forgot to look at my datapad to see the entry mentioned in this thread about Lucas comenting on Agatha.

Tho only think that comes to mind is Lucas couldnt act till the Orcale sacrficed again to get another vision, only the Orcale could do that and why the AI was watching him as well.

[sparrowtm]

Thanks for all the answers so far, some things have cleared up now. Still buggered about the 2000 year old oracle, though tonguegre

[Acleacius]

Errr I just replayed much of thegame and where Lucas meets Carla in the cemetary there is a dialague about "other murders" and Lucas says "the Orcale silenced Agatha before she helped me"

So Agatha was alive and killed by the Orcale and the AI confesses using Agatha's image so it's back to your orginal question when does the AI take her over, doh!

I am sure the Crows mean something thou always around watching Lucas.

Maybe someone with Meso-America knowledge will post.

I think probably some are plot holes and/or cut features, seems this game has struggled to get published and made as many do nodays, sadly.

They did a great job in getting this game made and it quite a nice gender these guys are fostering with cross platform balance and inovation :)

One part that really confused me and from looking at some post was the AI showing up out of nowhere.
I think I have a possible explination besides it being Deus Ex, I am betting the AI was affected by the Chroma source at the military base.
I remember during the explination once Lucas has the child underground the guy says it is believed that they are a Rouge AI that gained awareness, or somethign like that, which would explain how they have control over the Chroma like Lucas.
Except the AI was aware of the Chroma and learned about it, thou Lucas never understood why strange things (visions) happened to him.

Edit
Wow 22 days did disappear, that must be part of the story gaps, guess they had to cut much of the game due to time or budget constraints :(
Can only hope that they willl restore the missing parts of the game, must also be why the Bouns area will not completly unlock seems the most we can get is 82%.
If a patch is sale dependent we could be in for a wait before a patch is released.

[Darth Morbus]

When Lucas starts having the visions he's all susprised by them and yet in the army flashback scenes he's had them since he was a kid so my questions are

A) How come he doesn't remember having them when he has the first vision in his apartment?

and
B) If he hasn't had a vision since he was a kid why did he stat having them again during and after the murder?

If you read Lucas' PDA then this will (kind of) be explained.

[montnoir]

I am betting the AI was affected by the Chroma source at the military base.
I think it is a safe bet to presume the military used the Chroma artifact to power the AI which allowed it to gain consciousness and powers similar to the Oracle and Lucas.

I think it is also safe to presume that there were a lot of scenes cut. It is rather obvious.





Oh and Acleacius, don't we know each other from some vampire-game forum?

Anyway, to avoid further miscommunication. You are using the word "gender" wrongly, what you are referring to is the word "genre".

"What is your gender?" means "Are you male or female?".

"This game is in the adventure genre" means "this game is in a certain category". I think this is what you meant.

[sezegg]

I wanted to know what happened to taylor.. when u tell him not to go.
You should see him at the end.

[Acleacius]

"Oh and Acleacius, don't we know each other from some vampire-game forum?"

Yes, hello montnoir :)

"You are using the word "gender" wrongly"

Of course, you are correct, darn those late night post during braindrain, thanks for the correction :)


I kinda just put this together (I know I am slow) the reason Carla & Lucas in the last scene so easily and her saying she loved him without really any explination.
The story in it's currently cut status is they have been living together for the missing 22 days, she was hiding him and caring for him.
I saw a scene after winning a minigame, I had seen the first time I play which didnt make sence of her comforting him after a nightmare/vision in her apartment in her nice white undies :P

I find one thing a little annoying why does he constantly run round with bandages wraped in his palm (his forarms where cut), even in the last scene good ending in the park after he has the secret of/to life, so what he cant heal himself and take the dang bandages off? :)

[sezegg]

ah yeah i saw the scene in her apartment with lucas

it all makes sense now

[RoyalGamer]

1) clan orange cuz they wanted to set Lucas up (remember what Carla and Tyler saw at Lucas appartment) They knew he was comin so they did all that he would be catched and put in jail...
Maybe Oracle did control some other guy or they had their own ppl who could do the dirty job..
Purples needed Lucas so they didn't had to set him up
2)definetly... its not even a quesion to answer
3) ---
4)as far as i understood they did use some tehnology to make him alive again... not really claer... but its not as important.. cuz of lack of realism in story(didn't say its bad)
5)same old story ... see answer 4)
6)i think he had some skills of tell...
the story line in this game is not realistic... so there is no need to look for explanations... i just got tired of answering your question cuz i realized you could give 100 more such type questions starting with Did Carla had brest implants cuz of her big boobs and ending with Why did Lucas and Tiffany broke up or Why did Markus knew about such Agatha if he didn't believe in such things... Many many many question can be asked.... but we ll never know the truth .. cuz there is no truth

[DutchRaven]

1) clan orange cuz they wanted to set Lucas up (remember what Carla and Tyler saw at Lucas appartment) They knew he was comin so they did all that he would be catched and put in jail...
Maybe Oracle did control some other guy or they had their own ppl who could do the dirty job..
Purples needed Lucas so they didn't had to set him up
2)definetly... its not even a quesion to answer
3) ---
4)as far as i understood they did use some tehnology to make him alive again... not really claer... but its not as important.. cuz of lack of realism in story(didn't say its bad)
5)same old story ... see answer 4)
6)i think he had some skills of tell...
the story line in this game is not realistic... so there is no need to look for explanations... i just got tired of answering your question cuz i realized you could give 100 more such type questions starting with Did Carla had brest implants cuz of her big boobs and ending with Why did Lucas and Tiffany broke up or Why did Markus knew about such Agatha if he didn't believe in such things... Many many many question can be asked.... but we ll never know the truth .. cuz there is no truth


u defenitly need to watch X-Files dude ;).........

[Orion Saccuroa]

Hey,

after finishing Fahrenheit for the first time (and loving it), there are a few things which I might not have noticed, or have not been answered. Any help, speculations or superior knowledge is appreciated :wink2:


1.) Agathas death. Who killed her? Clan purple or clan orange?
2.) Was Agathas spirit-form always possessed by the clan purple cyborg?
3.) If it was not, when did clan purple take her form over?
4.) How did clan purple resurrect Lucas, them being A.I.s, not magicians?
5.) How was the cyborg able to manifest itself in the real world?
6.) The tarot-cards showed Carla a very precise version of the future. Was Tommy a psychic? Or were the "magical viiiibes" going on in NY responsible? Coincidence?
7.) The Oracle said he waited over 2000 years for that day to come. Which is strange, since he shows prominent Meso-American features, yet to my knowledge Meso-America wasn't inhabited at that time. Or at least, Mayan culture and rituals didn't exist yet. Am I wrong? If not, where did the Oracle come from?
8.) What happened in the month between Lucas meeting Carla at the graveyard and the next scene? Did they just idle and waited for Lucas to get another vision?

These are the first questions that came to my mind. Remember, "it was a plot device" doesn't count as an answer. :laugh:


1. My bet has to be clan purple beceause that way they had a friendly face to take over and show kane
2. Yes since the first scene you see agatha your already dead and she's reviving you
3.doesn't need to be anwswered
4. its an AI for gods sake... its has the knowlidge of the entire world... its manifested out of the internet they either broken his fal and made up a story rolleyesa or they just patch him up and stimulated his brain a human brain can only be declared clinikly dead if it hasn't had blood flowing trough for atleast 30 mins
5.this is explaind if you talk to bogart in the underground metro station.
6.I would say she is linked to the profecy of kane so it would be magical vibes/ Her destiny...
7.I would check your history al native americans lived there longer then our year callender exists...
8.Nobody knows its just the biggest GAP that there is in this game... seems to me that the creators goth either sloppy or cut a whole lot out of the so the game had a more movie feel to it since you can play trough the game in about 3 hours... (ahwel I would have cut out tyler since he doesn't have any impact on the game ... only thing he's good for is comedy relied :) eve if its very nice to see his quarel with gril :p )

[frosty_hotboy]

4.) How did clan purple resurrect Lucas, them being A.I.s, not magicians?


After you fall from the rollercoaster you get an cutscene where you see some bluish white blobs, or something like that, and hear some voices (which will later be recognised as the AIs) saying that you're dead but there's still some cerebreal activity. "He's probably dreaming". Then you remember sneaking with your brother in the army camp. Then after you've rescued the indigo child and reach Agatha/AI after it tells you you're dead choose resurected as the dialog option and it will say they implanted someting in your cortex to keep you somewhat alive (aslo says it wasn't such a big deal for them). He can kill you by touching you because he deactivates or shorts out (or something like that) the implant (the last sentence is just my assumption).

[wdibiase]

bla bla bla...

NEVER (never) in the story says in which year the events happen.
Imagine, Lucas was a child in the 50's. If the story would occurs at the present, he must have more than 60 years. Clearly he isn't 60 years old.
So, 2000 years ago could be anytime.

[DaFreaK]

bla bla bla...
NEVER (never) in the story says in which year the events happen.


I believe 2009 was mentioned as the year he becomes a murderer in the diner.

[Marcus-Kane]

i dont know about this but i might be right


the qusetion was

6.) The tarot-cards showed Carla a very precise version of the future. Was Tommy a psychic? Or were the "magical viiiibes" going on in NY responsible? Coincidence?

in the game tommy mentions that his grandma was psychic which got me thinking was his grandma agatha dont know just a wild guess

[frosty_hotboy]

I believe 2009 was mentioned as the year he becomes a murderer in the diner.

If you look at the start of the game (on the fly-by toward and above NY) where the WTC should be you would see that another building is build (the one that they plan to build now, I can't remember it's name), so it's in the near future.

[Dugular]

bla bla bla...

NEVER (never) in the story says in which year the events happen.
Imagine, Lucas was a child in the 50's. If the story would occurs at the present, he must have more than 60 years. Clearly he isn't 60 years old.
So, 2000 years ago could be anytime.

It is based in 2009. Lucas says his parents died ten years ago. When you see their gravestone with Marcus, it says they lived from xxxx-1999 (I can't remember the birth years). 2009 is ten years from 1999.

And the building the Americans are working on is called the Freedom Tower :)

[Oracurax]

I didn't notice that so much time had passed after the meeting in the cemetary, but it still puzzles me how almost out of nowhere Carla says she loves Lucas and then have have sex with a "dead" person, which she - even now after all this time - still commented that was cold. I just find it a bit strange, and sort of out of character, that Carla went from showing no romantic emotions towards Lucas to comment on his coldness, then suddenly say she loved him, then getting it on with a less-than-alive Lucas.

Another thing that puzzled me a little was how few emotions he showed towards his ex-girl friend's death, but I put this down as an effect of his "dead" state (aka emotionless). But then, when Carla gets naked, he suddenly seems to be everything but emotionless. I figured he wouldn't be able to do what he did in his current state, but apparently he could even make Carla pregnant.

Any comments, insight, speculations about this?

That said, it was a great (although short) game with alot of great moments. I much prefer the good old point-and-click controls of the old adventure games over this console approach, though. But that aside, the game had a great "feel" to it. Emotions, mood, setting. All good.

[Macgyver]

I didn't notice that so much time had passed after the meeting in the cemetary, but it still puzzles me how almost out of nowhere Carla says she loves Lucas and then have have sex with a "dead" person, which she - even now after all this time - still commented that was cold. I just find it a bit strange, and sort of out of character, that Carla went from showing no romantic emotions towards Lucas to comment on his coldness, then suddenly say she loved him, then getting it on with a less-than-alive Lucas.

Another thing that puzzled me a little was how few emotions he showed towards his ex-girl friend's death, but I put this down as an effect of his "dead" state (aka emotionless). But then, when Carla gets naked, he suddenly seems to be everything but emotionless. I figured he wouldn't be able to do what he did in his current state, but apparently he could even make Carla pregnant.

Any comments, insight, speculations about this?

That said, it was a great (although short) game with alot of great moments. I much prefer the good old point-and-click controls of the old adventure games over this console approach, though. But that aside, the game had a great "feel" to it. Emotions, mood, setting. All good.


Their baby will be an undead zombie or something when it's born. Well you can't blame the incompendent people who wrote the story, perhaps in a squal we'll see the meaning of this absured twist in the story. :salut2:

[Dugular]

I didn't notice that so much time had passed after the meeting in the cemetary, but it still puzzles me how almost out of nowhere Carla says she loves Lucas and then have have sex with a "dead" person, which she - even now after all this time - still commented that was cold. I just find it a bit strange, and sort of out of character, that Carla went from showing no romantic emotions towards Lucas to comment on his coldness, then suddenly say she loved him, then getting it on with a less-than-alive Lucas.

Another thing that puzzled me a little was how few emotions he showed towards his ex-girl friend's death, but I put this down as an effect of his "dead" state (aka emotionless). But then, when Carla gets naked, he suddenly seems to be everything but emotionless. I figured he wouldn't be able to do what he did in his current state, but apparently he could even make Carla pregnant.

Any comments, insight, speculations about this?

That said, it was a great (although short) game with alot of great moments. I much prefer the good old point-and-click controls of the old adventure games over this console approach, though. But that aside, the game had a great "feel" to it. Emotions, mood, setting. All good.

That whole last part of the game was rushed through way to quickly, but here are some things that might make it easier to digest.

I think about a week and a half passed from when Lucas' ex died to when he met Carla in the graveyard. She died around the 28th or 29th of January, and Lucas meets Carla around the 6th of February? I'll check for correct dates. So Lucas has already had a week to grieve over her. Not to mention the threat of the end of the world was probably starting to take over on his priorities.

Also, by the time Carla says "I love you", I think Carla and Lucas had been living together for about a month. There's a brief cutscene somewhere that shows Lucas waking up from a nightmare in Carla's apartment, with a half naked Carla going to comfort him.

[Oracurax]

I have to admit that I didn't pay attention to the date at all towards the end. I just thought the cold comment in the train was a bit strange if they had lived together. Oh well...

Do you know exactly where the scene with Lucas in Carla's apartment is? I must have missed that, so would be nice if someone could help me out so I could redo that chapter.


I have to say that the chapter section of the game makes replaying really more fun. You don't have to look through a bunch of save games you make yourself (and I would probably never make that many) and can more easily watch certain parts again. I like this movie-like feature alot.

But then I have to say I dislike the up/down/left/right button mashing in the middle of really cool scenes. I was too busy trying to hit all the correct buttons to really pay any attention to the cool Matrix-like combat scene vs the Oracle. Same thing with other button heavy scenes. It's okay when you play the guitar or whatever, but when there's alot of cool stuff going on I would rather push a button by reacting to what's going on than to push a button based on what colour that flashes. Oh well. I just wish you could at least replay those scenes without any button mashing later on, but not all the scenes are avaliable for that I think sour:

[Macgyver]

That whole last part of the game was rushed through way to quickly, but here are some things that might make it easier to digest.

I think about a week and a half passed from when Lucas' ex died to when he met Carla in the graveyard. She died around the 28th or 29th of January, and Lucas meets Carla around the 6th of February? I'll check for correct dates. So Lucas has already had a week to grieve over her. Not to mention the threat of the end of the world was probably starting to take over on his priorities.

Also, by the time Carla says "I love you", I think Carla and Lucas had been living together for about a month. There's a brief cutscene somewhere that shows Lucas waking up from a nightmare in Carla's apartment, with a half naked Carla going to comfort him.

Lets not forget that if you choose to dislike your ex in luca's appartment, the game maker would have had to take that into consideration about the morning of her death so it appears they've tried to find a happy medium with skipping a week or so ahead from her death, not the mention how long the A.I's would have kept you to make you into a half-dead (or whatever it is lucas turns out to be; cold and lifeless like body).

[Alter-Ego]

The story in it's currently cut status is they have been living together for the missing 22 days, she was hiding him and caring for him.
I saw a scene after winning a minigame, I had seen the first time I play which didnt make sence of her comforting him after a nightmare/vision in her apartment in her nice white undies :P

What minigame?

[Rakan]

It not a mini game, I think it's the first or second time you play as the oracle when it's in that council when they discuss Lucas... Complete the "Simon Says" sequence and Lucas will wake up from the nightmare and Carla being there.